Early "A" Engraving

[Sporrns]

My early 16 ga. AE, 300220, has engraving characteristics pretty much identical to the pictured Turnbull-refinished gun. Kevin

[fxe]

I just studied the engraving in this thread, and take a look at Birdog's early A engraving. It is distinctly different from the other two in that the embellishment around the hinge pin and sear pin is more ornate. And again, Turnbull did not touch the engraving on sn200029. If we all see three distinct but minor variations in engraving on four samples in this thread, is it so hard to believe that sn200029 just had a different touch. I am not being defensive on this topic, just taking my experience and coming up with a very likely conclusion that there is a variation of early A engraving that is not often seen or simply just on this gun. How else do you explain Birdog's gun and its differences? Most of you guys should know that you can never say "they didn't do that". Look closely at the engraving. The photos are clear. You see any signs of a recut? This is the way the gun left the factory, in my humble opinion, and should be noted for the record. Maybe we can get some more variations to be shown as a result of this thread???

[Researcher]

Is that "Skitz" next to the gun?

That was Skitso in early October 2005, the first time I took her hunting after getting her in April after she was finished with a litter of puppies. Sunday will be her 15th birthday --

Her daughter, Dasher, from that litter, that two of my buddies have had, had to be put down this spring with congestive heart disease. Dasher blew out a knee a couple of years ago and had $6000 worth of titanium knee for her last years.

2007

I think it is safe to say, that our little thread here has shown that there is quite a bit of variety in the early A-/AE-Grade engraving patterns. Now, was it just different engravers, or time period, or?

[eightbore]

Jay, Kevin, and others, all of us having watched talented engravers at work, we realize that enhancements of early A and early B and C engraving patterns can be done while the guy at the next bench is having his coffee.

[Researcher]

Found a couple of pictures of 200067 on my basement laptop --

200067-03.jpg (76.07 KiB) Viewed 7834 times

200067-04.jpg (74.52 KiB) Viewed 7834 times

[fxe]

Hey Kevin (Sporns), Can you post a photos showing the pattern?

[fxe]

Eightbore,

I am well aware of the talent of engravers. I have had a DHE engraving recut by one of the best, and with the naked eye you could not discern any evidence of a recut. However, under magnification you could. I would say it is impossible to recut any amount of engraving and not have evidence of it, unless the old engraving was eliminated prior the the recut. That is my experience. Maybe some top-notch engravers can chime in on that topic? I am hoping Kevin can post a photo of his 16ga., or someone else has another variation again. I would say if another early A pops up with the same or very similar engraving to the one I have it would cement the idea that there are variations. I know the condition of this gun when I got it, and I am 100% certain that it is an original, so put that in the records when another pops up.

I actually find it hard to believe that many would go to the "recut" explanation rather than "another variation" explanation for the differences. It is not that unusual to find another variation in an engraving pattern, and unless you believe that all the engraving was wiped off sn200029 and recut, I think an established engraver will confirm that a recut will show under magnification.

Keeping an open mind allows valid information to flow. Always learning something new in this continuing education on 100 year old firearms!

Jay Shachter, President
Vintage Firearm Inc

www.vfiguns.com

[fox-admin]

Here is one I owned 17607

[fox-admin]

Here is the one from the D Talbert collection

[loggy]

Dana certainly had some great guns. He left an open spot for a nice B grade.

[jolly bill]

Here's an early A 12 gauge, SN 19823 with tags . . .

[jolly bill]

And here's another earlier A grade 12, SN 7983. A gun that I've had for just a month shy of 49 years. Shot about 7,000 light loads thru the old gal in the last 5 or 6 years. Still locks up tight like a bank vault.

[Sporrns]

Hey Kevin (Sporns), Can you post a photos showing the pattern?

OK here they are:

[vaturkey]

Hey Kevin (Sporns), Can you post a photos showing the pattern?

OK here they are:

Kevin is that the small bore that had ejectors with the escutcheon? If so can you post a picture of the escutcheon please. Thanks

[Sporrns]

Hey Kevin (Sporns), Can you post a photos showing the pattern?

OK here they are:

Kevin is that the small bore that had ejectors with the escutcheon? If so can you post a picture of the escutcheon please. Thanks

OMG! - Tom!! I do SO much to keep you happy1 So don't forget to CALL ME when you come across that 32" 20 gauge Sterly!! (Or AE or BE)1

Here it is Buddy -