Custom Fox

[JT65]

Just purchased a 20 bore fox sterlingworth, with ejectors.I would like to upgrade the gun to a CE grade,please tell me where to start first,i would also like to restock,also any ideas of who to use i leave in New Jersey.Thank you Jim Thoma

[fox-admin]

If you want a shop that can to it all and is recognized one of the best go to Turnbull's
http://www.turnbullrestoration.com/
The type of upgrade you are planning will cost around $6000 depending the wood you use. Have fun. Doug's shop is in West Bloomfield, outside of Rochester, NY. If I were you I would drive up and discuss your project with Doug and examine his work.

[bamboozler]

Here's a rough layout in the steps involved, but by all means not all-inclusive:

1. The first thing to do is define your goals as far as configuration of the gun, engraving style, budget and time table. (Food for thought: Have contingencies built into your budget and time table.)
2. Assemble a team of experienced craftsmen (metalsmith, stocker, engraver and casemaker) whom you are are able to communicate effectively with. It will be beneficial to your set goals and expectations if the craftsmen you choose work and communicate well with each other.
3. The gun goes to your metalsmith for removal of "STERLINGWORTH" roll stamping by stoning it off or tig welding it in, removal of engraving, polishing, action, trigger sculpting, straight grip conversion, etc.
4. The gun now is ready for your stocker. You should have already selected the wood and have had a custom fitting, if not a custom fitting then atleast dimensions from a gun you shoot well. A stocker who has your best interests in mind will have you shoot the gun for impact testing after he has roughed the stock out and has gotten the stock dimensions close to your chosen dimensions. After this tweaking, it goes back to the stocker for further fitting, final finishing and checkering.
5. The gun now goes back to the metalsmith for further polishing where the stocker has inevitably struck the metal in his fitting the wood to the action.
6. The gun now goes to your engraver for him to do his thing. (Unless you've giving the engraver free artistic reign you have already discussed exactly what you want and he has supplied you sketches of his lay out.)
7. The gun now goes back to your metalsmith for final finishing, i.e. casecoloring, rust bluing, final assembly, etc.
8. The gun now goes to your custom casemaker.

[Silvers]

Some additional thoughts to supplement those written here by Craig and Greg. Many purist collectors will turn their heads at a custom Fox and you'll get comments like "you'll never get your money out of it". IMO that really depends on who does the work. Also how you feel about spending money to get a gun that fits you and can be taken out in the field for great memories - versus a Fox that may be pristine but is ill fitting, or you're afraid of getting it dinged or scratched, thus it sits in a safe 99.99% of the time. White glove material.

Of course I'd never advise anyone to take apart a collector quality Fox and fool with it. But there are many old Foxes out there that have been well used, abused, modified, broken stocks and are of little/no interest to a collector. IMO they deserve to be brought back. Yep - if you have the local guy install a 90% prefit stock, hunter quality reblue of the barrels, flashy recasing, etc. you're going to get a modified Fox that may fit you, look OK and shoot well, but will have low interest to anyone else down the road. Lose money? Probably, but if it doesn't matter to you so what?

On the other hand there are MASTERS out there, gents who are good enough to be accepted as ACGG members, who today are doing superior quality work on custom classic-styled Foxes that are likely to appreciate. I'm speaking now of gents like Craig Libhart, Doug Mann, Geoffroy Gournet, Ken Hurst, etc. Their work reminds me of the classic custom 1903 Springfields and Model '98 Mausers done decades ago by then-not-appreciated geniuses like Alvin Linden, Bob Owen, Ad Minar, Niedner Arms Co, G&H, August Pachmayr, Hoffman Arms, etc. Check on prices for classic guns redone by these and other old time masters and you'll see they've appreciated exponentially and are highly sought after. I guess it boils down to: you get what you pay for. Are these Masters waiting for you to show up at their door? Nope. You might have to wait a year or more in queue. Will their work cost more than the local guy? Yep but it's worth it. Will you get a great ROI if you want to sell your custom Fox a month or so after getting it back? Probably not.

MY OPINIONS - you can make some money by buying collector quality Foxes, holding them for a long while and reselling down the road. Better than other investments? That hasn't been the case for me except when found a gun and the person didn't know what they had. Let's say a gent had about $4500. about 6 months ago to buy a nice collector quality C grade Fox. But he bought 1500 shares of Ford instead. That C Fox would still bring about $4500. but the Ford stock would have brought $11,250. if sold yesterday. Most of those collecting nice Foxes are doing it because they love the guns and their history; I don't think many expect to make a windfall profit (if any at all) over the short haul.

Regarding "losing money on a gun" - either a custom one or by carefully using a collector quality one - I often think of the gent who doesn't think one whit about dropping 20% or so of the value of his new $40k SUV in the minutes after he drives it off the showroom floor. But the same gent can't sleep and sweats blood over losing a few hundred bucks or so on a gun - even though he might shoot it well and make some great memories in the field with it. Doesn't make sense to me at least. But I guess that's what makes the world go around. Silvers

[ASavageFox]

Regarding "losing money on a gun" - either a custom one or by carefully using a collector quality one - I often think of the gent who doesn't think one whit about dropping 20% or so of the value of his new $40k SUV in the minutes after he drives it off the showroom floor. But the same gent can't sleep and sweats blood over losing a few hundred bucks or so on a gun - even though he might shoot it well and make some great memories in the field with it. Doesn't make sense to me at least. But I guess that's what makes the world go around. Silvers

I think this exact thought all of the time.

This all has been very informative for me...

Jim,
there are some great pics of some custom foxes in the pictures section...