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Hello. I am a first time poster. I hope it is ok to ask this sort of question here. I have come across an AH Fox Grade A 12 gauge for sale. Serial # 17xxx. Extractors only. They are asking $565 plus tax. Overall it is in good shape - the bluing is all there, though it is a little browned. A few splotches on the buttstock. A few small dings on the forearm. I don’t think there’s much, if any, case color left. The engraving is the same as shown for the early grade A on the Fox collectors website. There are 2 issues though. They are shown in the attached photos.
First, there is some discoloring or corrosion of the inside of the left barrel near the center rib. It’s not the color I’m used to seeing for rust, so wasn’t sure what it was. How much does this affect value and shooting?
Muzzle discoloration
Second, there is a large chunk out of the stock at the breech / firing pin area on the right side. The stock is still very solid. Is this safe to shoot?
Muzzle discoloration
I really like old mechanical things with lots of craftsmanship. I also collect and use old cameras. I have been shooting since I was a kid. I really like the engraving and fit on these old guns.
I guess my main question would be whether this is worth the asking price considering the damage and potential repairs that need to be made. I don’t want to flip it, just want to make sure I’m making a good investment. Thank you for any help you can provide. Sorry there aren’t more or better pictures.
Agree with what Craig (Fox Admin) said. For the asking price of that gun you can find a solid Sterlingworth, which is a grade lower than the A, and is mechanically the same but with minimal engraving. Good luck with your search.
I should also mention that if would become a member here you would gain access to our members only forum where members post their guns for sale. Then you could have confidence that the gun you buy here would be one without problems.
Craig and Daryl - thanks very much for your replies. It’s a good thing I checked here first! I’m disappointed. I thought I had found a good deal. So you really think it is epoxy? I would never have thought that. So, based on what it is, is there an acceptable price for it or just forget it?
Regarding the Sterlingworth, that sounds good except I really would like one with some engraving. That is part of the appeal to me. What would I be looking at for a decent Grade A? I’d also be a little nervous about buying one without handling it to make sure it fits. I don’t know my shotgun fit measurements. I haven’t seen too many decent old shotguns around here in east TN, but haven’t looked too hard lately. I came across this one in an antique store. I did see a 20 gauge Sterlingworth in a shop a few years ago for around $600, but it did not have the engraving so I wasn’t as interested, though I’d probably like the gauge better.
Thanks again for the expertise. If you guys have anything further based on what I’ve said or anyone else has advice, I’d love to hear it. I’m not really in too big a hurry to purchase right now. Like I said, I just thought I’d found a good deal.
You should be able to get a shootable 12ga A grade for $1K +/-; they are out there. 16's and 20's are going to be considerably more of course. When I was looking for an A grade 12 I had several offered to me around that range. Early A's like the one you're looking at really don't have much more engraving than a Sterlingworth if that's important to you. You can find 12ga Sterlys for $500-600 if you wait, but again, 16's and 20's are going to up the ante. The wait is the problem - believe me, I know. But this one is a money pit on the plus side, and on the down side may not even be safe to shoot. JMO.
I suppose that could be epoxy but also could be something like varnish that dripped/ran down onto the barrels while someone was varnishing trim or woodwork. I've seen many old SxS's with drops of paint here and there and often wonder why the painter didn't move the gun out of the way. In any case it looks like the top barrel keel (steel filler between the tubes at the muzzle) is there, and the yellowish material is in the muzzle, not on the barrel ends as it would be for a mickey-mouse keel repair. Then again it could be paste soldering flux from a solder replacement of the lower barrel keel (which we can't see in the pic) but if so I'd wonder why the guy didn't clean it up. You haven't told us much about the specs nor the mechanical and cosmetic condition of that Fox so it's hard to put a value on it, but if you're good with wood that missing piece wouldn't be hard to fill in, reshape and spot-finish. If everything else checks out she might make a good "shooter Fox" after wood repairs. If so and if a common-featured early A-Grade why not offer something like $250 for it? Cash money or walk out the door. Of course all this will give high end collectors the jitters.
All this JMO. frank
Last edited by Silvers on Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
Everyone- thanks very much for the added input. Unfortunately, I wasn’t really looking for a shotgun when I came across the 20 gauge Sterlingworth. Nor did I know that 20 gauges in those older guns were more rare. I will know now, though!
Regarding this 12 gauge Fox Grade A, other than those 2 major issues, everything else seemed OK to very good. Condition wise, the bluing was all there though somewhat browned with age. There was one 1 inch scratch on one of the barrels. There was also a little bit of rust near the muzzle on the underside where the metal between the barrels (don’t remember the technical term) is connected to the barrel that has the epoxy or varnish in it. It was very light, but right there on that seam. The only other things I noted were discolored age? splotches on the buttstock finish and a few small impressions on the forearm.
Mechanically, the gun seemed very good, and not very worn at all. The latch to break it open was somewhat stiff but not in a bad way. More like it had not been used much. It seemed to lock up very tightly. I removed the forearm- that seemed to snap on and off very precisely. I did not try the triggers as I do not have any snap caps. The only other thing I noticed is that I did see some light around the firing pin hole on the side the chunk was out of the stock when shining my light there. I probably need to confirm there is a pin in there.
I have to go get my deposit back, so I will check those things and maybe offer him what Frank said. I don’t think he will take it though. I think he has about $450 in it and thinks it’s worth about $1000.
Good luck on the return visit. Just one additional comment; an A H Fox shotgun may be be dry-fired on empty chambers as much as you'd like without damage to the so-called firing pins because they're the tips of the hammers. frank
Great. So it sounds like if it has been opened and not fired, I should just see a hole with light in it and no pin. This is different than my experience with other more modern break open guns. Thanks again for all the feedback. If anyone has anything else based on my condition description above, please let me know. It sounds like the main concern is whatever is on the barrel muzzle wall and whether it is cosmetic or an attempted repair.
